Listen to them.
Of course, listening doesn't mean you have to heed their advice. Like I mentioned in my first post, my family and friends were all very supportive of my decision to quit. It was fairly clearly a good choice, if not the best, for me.
I did, however, have one very strong voice to seriously consider the things I was giving up. There are many opportunities that just having a JD can present. (Admittedly less in this economy than in times past, but still, having a JD on your resume can put you in a better standing with almost any employer than not having one.) I was very glad that this individual was there to be that voice. He reminded me of just what law school could mean to me. I listened to him for a good hour while he chatted with me about my decision. I didn't fill him in on everything, but he knew pretty much the whole picture. He gave good advice.
He made a compelling case for sticking with it, but I still chose to quit. I am very grateful that he forced me through that. Having had that conversation let me know just how seriously I was taking this decision. Moreover, even in the face of a fairly comprehensive list of what I was giving up, I still felt strongly enough about quitting to do so. While I did have some pangs of regret, I came out of the conversation stronger in my resolve to make this life-changing decision count.
This critic had my best interests at heart. I know, though, that there are many people that have familial or other pressures that land them in law school in the first place. If you have overbearing parents, or people in your life with lofty expectations of you, they may be extremely critical of your decision. Maybe you have a family that's relying on you for support, and don't want to make any risky moves with your career plans. I'm sorry. Those situations are elements to your law school experience that I don't know much about. I'm sure that makes law school feel even more like a prison if you hate it. I hope you have others with whom you can speak. Heck, talk to me! Ask me questions in the comments, or I'll give you my email upon request. Just try to include as many voices as you can so that the possibly overbearing ones aren't the only ones you're hearing. (Or just tell them to shove it? Your choice. But probably not the best choice for the sake of preserving familial/other relationships.)
My point, I think, is remember that in quitting, you are/would be giving up a lot. But in facing the comprehensive list of "but if you just finish"-isms that your critics will throw at you, you may still find the benefits of quitting to weigh more. Take your critics' comments in stride. They'll be for the better when it comes to needing the resolve to make something great of your decision to quit and do something else.
Next time on How to Quit Law School: Quitting law school just blew up my résumé. What to do with your résumé after quitting law school.
Showing posts with label should I quit law school. Show all posts
Showing posts with label should I quit law school. Show all posts
How to Deal With Critics of Your Decision to Go to Law School
Listen to them.
I know you won't, but listen anyway. I had some folks telling me flat-out: "Don't go." I didn't listen. I still stand by not listening. I felt like going to law school was the right decision for me, and I still feel like it was. I know that sounds messed up given my most recent decision regarding law school. But I gained a lot. A lot of knowledge, friends, and general life experience. An adventure, really sucky at times, well worth it.
So, listen to your critics, make a rational decision, or do neither. Go with your gut. Do whatever you feel is right. My point: it's your decision. I certainly don't mean by "Listen to them," that you have to do what they say. I think you should at the very least factor it in. I just hope you'll remember that if you get through the first semester or two and hate it, that you don't have to be stuck there. Responsibly and seriously consider pulling out and exploring your other options. Don't wait too long to reassess.
If law school is all you've ever wanted, I don't know what to tell you folks exactly. I did not have the legal ambition until after I was already halfway done with undergrad. So, I don't really know how to relate with you, but I suppose if you are reading this, just know that it's not the end of the world if you hate it. Don't be afraid to give it a year, and then reassess and determine if law school and the law is really what you thought it was. Perhaps my advice means follow your dreams, until they're not your dreams anymore?
Legal education in this country could use a lot of improvements. It's a hoop-jumping system that charges increasingly exorbitant amounts of money each year to teach you mostly things that will never come in handy after the bar is over. But if you're taking your decision seriously, you already know that. You're ready to jump. I was, too. I knew the checkmarks I'd have to get before I completed the somewhat arbitrary legal checklist. As it turned out, my life didn't make it easy, and I realized that the hoop-jumping didn't feel like it was going to be worth it. I felt in prison, and you just might, too. Just be prepared for it not to be exactly like you may have always hoped it would be.
To George Mason's credit, they very clearly let us 1Ls know that the legal market and law school itself would not be a delightful diversion. Many of my classmates commented that they were freaked out by how bluntly we were told that it was going to be rough. I cannot say I was not fairly warned.
Just because I quit law school, does not mean that I hate everything about it, or that I think everyone should get out. I still love some aspects of the law, and the great societal utility it can provide. I had first-class, accomplished classmates who are headed for great things. I learned that the law can be used in some very admirable and noble ways. I had some great professors that taught me some things that will be useful for the rest of my life. I worked with judges and lawyers that afforded me some unforgettable experiences and lessons.
I tried to fit the law into my life, but it wasn't working. That's an oversimplification of everything that lead to me quitting, but I just want readers to know that I still condone some people going into the law. It can be a great thing. It wasn't for me. Know that it just might not be for you, either.
Next time on How To Quit Law School: How to deal with critics of your decision to quit law school.
I know you won't, but listen anyway. I had some folks telling me flat-out: "Don't go." I didn't listen. I still stand by not listening. I felt like going to law school was the right decision for me, and I still feel like it was. I know that sounds messed up given my most recent decision regarding law school. But I gained a lot. A lot of knowledge, friends, and general life experience. An adventure, really sucky at times, well worth it.
So, listen to your critics, make a rational decision, or do neither. Go with your gut. Do whatever you feel is right. My point: it's your decision. I certainly don't mean by "Listen to them," that you have to do what they say. I think you should at the very least factor it in. I just hope you'll remember that if you get through the first semester or two and hate it, that you don't have to be stuck there. Responsibly and seriously consider pulling out and exploring your other options. Don't wait too long to reassess.
If law school is all you've ever wanted, I don't know what to tell you folks exactly. I did not have the legal ambition until after I was already halfway done with undergrad. So, I don't really know how to relate with you, but I suppose if you are reading this, just know that it's not the end of the world if you hate it. Don't be afraid to give it a year, and then reassess and determine if law school and the law is really what you thought it was. Perhaps my advice means follow your dreams, until they're not your dreams anymore?
Legal education in this country could use a lot of improvements. It's a hoop-jumping system that charges increasingly exorbitant amounts of money each year to teach you mostly things that will never come in handy after the bar is over. But if you're taking your decision seriously, you already know that. You're ready to jump. I was, too. I knew the checkmarks I'd have to get before I completed the somewhat arbitrary legal checklist. As it turned out, my life didn't make it easy, and I realized that the hoop-jumping didn't feel like it was going to be worth it. I felt in prison, and you just might, too. Just be prepared for it not to be exactly like you may have always hoped it would be.
To George Mason's credit, they very clearly let us 1Ls know that the legal market and law school itself would not be a delightful diversion. Many of my classmates commented that they were freaked out by how bluntly we were told that it was going to be rough. I cannot say I was not fairly warned.
Just because I quit law school, does not mean that I hate everything about it, or that I think everyone should get out. I still love some aspects of the law, and the great societal utility it can provide. I had first-class, accomplished classmates who are headed for great things. I learned that the law can be used in some very admirable and noble ways. I had some great professors that taught me some things that will be useful for the rest of my life. I worked with judges and lawyers that afforded me some unforgettable experiences and lessons.
I tried to fit the law into my life, but it wasn't working. That's an oversimplification of everything that lead to me quitting, but I just want readers to know that I still condone some people going into the law. It can be a great thing. It wasn't for me. Know that it just might not be for you, either.
Next time on How To Quit Law School: How to deal with critics of your decision to quit law school.
How to Analyze the Decision to Leave Law School
There is one key to any analysis of the decision to quit law school that is vital to keep in balance: your long-term priorities.
A decision to quit law school can definitely happen too fast. I have been contemplating this decision for months now and even I had a moment a few days ago amidst a conversation about the value of a JD where I felt panic-stricken. "Have I made this decision too quickly?!" I'm a strong advocate of getting out of there before you're too deep into it, but you absolutely must give this decision the respect and time it deserves. It's important.
"What are your dreams?"
A very good friend of mine gave me a great piece of advice when I found myself adrift and floundering to come up with the solution for my law school prison problem. She asked me a point blank question that caught me off guard: "What are your dreams?" ...I realized that I didn't have any. Not even was becoming a lawyer a former dream. I just didn't have any! She told me about a book she'd read. The author suggested that those adrift (like us lucky folks who need a blog like this) write down the following: five things you want to do in the next 6 months, five things you want to be in the next 6 months, five things you want to have in the next 6 months, and then repeat each for the next year. So you write out 30 things you want total. You look at these six lists and pick 3 things from each to focus on. I suggest doing the 1 year lists first and then using the 6 month ones to be incremental (half-way points?) goals toward the ultimate year goals. It's actually harder than you think to come up with these goals, but you should sit down and do it anyway... you're making a tough decision.
Doing this really helped me to find out that I do have some dreams. I tried to stay semi-realistic, but was liberal in giving myself some room to dream in setting my goals. I have some fun goals, and some that are very practical. (Having enough money for debt payments. No, duh.)
I guess the moral of including this in this post, is that if you find law-related things still showing up in your lists of goals, you should probably reconsider quitting law school. But if you, like me, find legal matters to be the furthest thing from your dreams... you know what to do.
The Old Tried and True
Pros and Cons Lists have been there to help me in making many decisions.
In order to make a decent pro and con list for this choice I had to circumvent the biggest obstacle presented by pro and con lists. Emotion. I often go into a list made willy-nilly knowing exactly which side will come out on top. To combat this I found a great website that factors emotion into the pros and cons in a helpful way. Pro Con Lists allows you to factor the emotional and rational nature of each individual pro or con. I highly recommend this site if you like the pro and con list analysis. (A quick perusal of the site just now reveals that my anonymous list is still there for you to view. :-/ )
Whatever your method, just remember to focus on your long-term priorities.
P.S. Perhaps you can get some funny, if not honest, folks to hash out the arguments for you.
P.P.S. Or, what about the economics of it all? (Wow, a little of my law school has definitely stuck with me.)
Next time on How to Quit Law School: The old ball and chain... THE DEBT!
A decision to quit law school can definitely happen too fast. I have been contemplating this decision for months now and even I had a moment a few days ago amidst a conversation about the value of a JD where I felt panic-stricken. "Have I made this decision too quickly?!" I'm a strong advocate of getting out of there before you're too deep into it, but you absolutely must give this decision the respect and time it deserves. It's important.
"What are your dreams?"
A very good friend of mine gave me a great piece of advice when I found myself adrift and floundering to come up with the solution for my law school prison problem. She asked me a point blank question that caught me off guard: "What are your dreams?" ...I realized that I didn't have any. Not even was becoming a lawyer a former dream. I just didn't have any! She told me about a book she'd read. The author suggested that those adrift (like us lucky folks who need a blog like this) write down the following: five things you want to do in the next 6 months, five things you want to be in the next 6 months, five things you want to have in the next 6 months, and then repeat each for the next year. So you write out 30 things you want total. You look at these six lists and pick 3 things from each to focus on. I suggest doing the 1 year lists first and then using the 6 month ones to be incremental (half-way points?) goals toward the ultimate year goals. It's actually harder than you think to come up with these goals, but you should sit down and do it anyway... you're making a tough decision.
Doing this really helped me to find out that I do have some dreams. I tried to stay semi-realistic, but was liberal in giving myself some room to dream in setting my goals. I have some fun goals, and some that are very practical. (Having enough money for debt payments. No, duh.)
I guess the moral of including this in this post, is that if you find law-related things still showing up in your lists of goals, you should probably reconsider quitting law school. But if you, like me, find legal matters to be the furthest thing from your dreams... you know what to do.
The Old Tried and True
Pros and Cons Lists have been there to help me in making many decisions.
- Pro: Buying this dog will give me a friend I can rely on to cheer me up when I get home from oppressive law school classes.
- Con: Buying this dog will lead to many a smelly surprise in my house.
In order to make a decent pro and con list for this choice I had to circumvent the biggest obstacle presented by pro and con lists. Emotion. I often go into a list made willy-nilly knowing exactly which side will come out on top. To combat this I found a great website that factors emotion into the pros and cons in a helpful way. Pro Con Lists allows you to factor the emotional and rational nature of each individual pro or con. I highly recommend this site if you like the pro and con list analysis. (A quick perusal of the site just now reveals that my anonymous list is still there for you to view. :-/ )
Whatever your method, just remember to focus on your long-term priorities.
P.S. Perhaps you can get some funny, if not honest, folks to hash out the arguments for you.
P.P.S. Or, what about the economics of it all? (Wow, a little of my law school has definitely stuck with me.)
Next time on How to Quit Law School: The old ball and chain... THE DEBT!
How to Talk Yourself Out of Law School
As promised, the following are the notes I took during one of my courtroom observing sessions while being a judicial intern this summer. Obviously I was VERY distracted. Yeah, people were being arraigned, getting cuffed, or being sentenced to prison while I was just jotting this stuff down on my legal sheets. I was initially just goofing around, but it became a fully formed legal-style memo. For some reason I thought it should be in the third person?
Judge Allphin's Criminal Calendar
"An"
Stable v. Fun
Issue: Whether under the weight of law school debt, Jeff should pursue a job that he enjoys or one that pays but he can handle?
Facts: Jeff is $100k in debt from a year and a half's worth of law school student loans. To this point, Jeff has only completed 35 credits, and has at least two years of prison remaining. Jeff could work in public service and get debt forgiveness after 25 years. Jeff could also have income contingent payments. Jeff hates law school. He doesn't really enjoy working in the law either. He has some desire to be a writer. He also wants to weigh these matters with some reality.
Statute: Debt collectors can be sicked on Jeff if he doesn't meet his obligations.
Analysis: Jeff's main goal is to be financially stable and not unhealthily unhappy with his job. The second part of that almost definitely precludes a legal job, as it is these jobs that have landed Jeff in this predicament. The weight of reality also seems to preclude Jeff dedicating too much time to writing, as that is a proven unlucrative field for millions of aspiring writers. Jeff could be crazy if he tries to continue law school, and likely would fail out or do very poorly. Jeff has multiple other options that he has entertained. He considers HR a field he would probably be good at, and that wouldn't make him very unhappy. He has always felt that he would be a teacher as well. This might not only satisfy his need to not be unhealthily unhappy, but it would have other benefits. Some feel that they have a few things in life that they're meant to do. This would fall in that category for Jeff. However, following this path has gotten Jeff into trouble before, as Jeff felt meant to go to law school. He did, however, feel before he made that decision that he was going to be humbled and fail. He feels that came to fruition, and that a "meant to do"-path may still be for him. Teaching would also carry financial benefits, whether Jeff pursues a PhD, or a teaching certificate that would permit him to teach college courses or high school courses, respectively. Either way, Jeff wouldn't have an extremely lucrative job, but if he teaches at a public institution he may qualify for public service debt forgiveness. Jeff may have other options, but none seems to be as good a solution as teaching. As far as his choice between the teaching certificate and pursuing a PhD, Jeff is concerned with his: (a) ability to gain acceptance to these programs and (b) ability to pay his debt in the interim between the present and starting the further schooling necessary. Jeff hasn't considered how quickly he could get going on the teaching certificate, but knows that he would have to wait a year before he could start a masters, preceding a PhD. This interim could be filled with a simple retail job, but that might not satisfy debt payments and other financial obligations. Jeff might pursue humanitarian causes during this interim, but also is concerned with the financial burden created by the opportunity costs.
Conclusion and recommendation: Given the seriousness of unhealthy unhappiness Jeff has experienced, it seems only proper that he quit law school entirely. Although this frightens him and may lead to difficulties, it seems to be for the best. It is recommended that Jeff seriously reconsider high school instruction, or that he do what is necessary to pursue a masters and a PhD. The interim is a matter he's capable of dealing with. He is capable of finding a decent-paying job. He can do it.
Next time on How to Quit Law School: pros and cons lists.
Judge Allphin's Criminal Calendar
Stable v. Fun
Issue: Whether under the weight of law school debt, Jeff should pursue a job that he enjoys or one that pays but he can handle?
Facts: Jeff is $100k in debt from a year and a half's worth of law school student loans. To this point, Jeff has only completed 35 credits, and has at least two years of prison remaining. Jeff could work in public service and get debt forgiveness after 25 years. Jeff could also have income contingent payments. Jeff hates law school. He doesn't really enjoy working in the law either. He has some desire to be a writer. He also wants to weigh these matters with some reality.
Statute: Debt collectors can be sicked on Jeff if he doesn't meet his obligations.
Analysis: Jeff's main goal is to be financially stable and not unhealthily unhappy with his job. The second part of that almost definitely precludes a legal job, as it is these jobs that have landed Jeff in this predicament. The weight of reality also seems to preclude Jeff dedicating too much time to writing, as that is a proven unlucrative field for millions of aspiring writers. Jeff could be crazy if he tries to continue law school, and likely would fail out or do very poorly. Jeff has multiple other options that he has entertained. He considers HR a field he would probably be good at, and that wouldn't make him very unhappy. He has always felt that he would be a teacher as well. This might not only satisfy his need to not be unhealthily unhappy, but it would have other benefits. Some feel that they have a few things in life that they're meant to do. This would fall in that category for Jeff. However, following this path has gotten Jeff into trouble before, as Jeff felt meant to go to law school. He did, however, feel before he made that decision that he was going to be humbled and fail. He feels that came to fruition, and that a "meant to do"-path may still be for him. Teaching would also carry financial benefits, whether Jeff pursues a PhD, or a teaching certificate that would permit him to teach college courses or high school courses, respectively. Either way, Jeff wouldn't have an extremely lucrative job, but if he teaches at a public institution he may qualify for public service debt forgiveness. Jeff may have other options, but none seems to be as good a solution as teaching. As far as his choice between the teaching certificate and pursuing a PhD, Jeff is concerned with his: (a) ability to gain acceptance to these programs and (b) ability to pay his debt in the interim between the present and starting the further schooling necessary. Jeff hasn't considered how quickly he could get going on the teaching certificate, but knows that he would have to wait a year before he could start a masters, preceding a PhD. This interim could be filled with a simple retail job, but that might not satisfy debt payments and other financial obligations. Jeff might pursue humanitarian causes during this interim, but also is concerned with the financial burden created by the opportunity costs.
Conclusion and recommendation: Given the seriousness of unhealthy unhappiness Jeff has experienced, it seems only proper that he quit law school entirely. Although this frightens him and may lead to difficulties, it seems to be for the best. It is recommended that Jeff seriously reconsider high school instruction, or that he do what is necessary to pursue a masters and a PhD. The interim is a matter he's capable of dealing with. He is capable of finding a decent-paying job. He can do it.
Next time on How to Quit Law School: pros and cons lists.
How To Quit Law School
Quitting law school is done best in one specific way... as soon as possible.
Hi! I am among the most recent class of law school dropouts and want to share my story to aid others who find themselves in the quandary of law school prison. What is law school prison? It's when you've decided you're going to stick with it. You go for a while, you don't love it, but you tell yourself, "I can do this for a while. I can just be a lawyer for a few years, then I'll move on to what I really want to do." This shortly leads to "I hate this. But I'm SO in debt. How could I possibly do anything else now?" Prison. Law-school-debt prison. Well, that's how I felt anyway. There are a myriad other reasons to quit law school, and certainly I have many more of my own, but whatever your reason, you should know that you're not alone, that you're not hopeless, and that life will just keep moving.
YOU'RE NOT ALONE:
Hi! I am among the most recent class of law school dropouts and want to share my story to aid others who find themselves in the quandary of law school prison. What is law school prison? It's when you've decided you're going to stick with it. You go for a while, you don't love it, but you tell yourself, "I can do this for a while. I can just be a lawyer for a few years, then I'll move on to what I really want to do." This shortly leads to "I hate this. But I'm SO in debt. How could I possibly do anything else now?" Prison. Law-school-debt prison. Well, that's how I felt anyway. There are a myriad other reasons to quit law school, and certainly I have many more of my own, but whatever your reason, you should know that you're not alone, that you're not hopeless, and that life will just keep moving.
YOU'RE NOT ALONE:
- Law schools lose students every year:
- Various schools' 2011 attrition rates 1st year / 2nd year:
- Akron: 19.6% / 4.4%
- George Mason: 16.2% / 1.7%
- George Washington: 6.4% / 4%
- Loyola Marymount: 11.5% / 2.2%
- Michigan State: 14.5% / 1%
- Quinnipiac: 10.4% / .9%
- Some are even advocating that students be paid to leave law school because legal education is such a mess!
YOU'RE NOT HOPELESS:
- Many successful people have dropped out of law school:
- Martin Luther
- Al Gore
- Demetri Martin (HILAROUS!)
- Diane Sawyer
- Paul Simon
- Vince Lombardi
- Ronald Baron (BILLIONAIRE)
- Carly Fiorina (CEO of Hewlett-Packard)
- Billy Joe McCombs (Dropped out to sell cars... BILLIONAIRE)
- Stewart Rahr (BILLIONAIRE)
- Theodore Roosevelt
- Harper Lee
- Leslie Wexner (BILLIONAIRE)
- Even Supreme Court Justice Cardozo dropped out of law school!
- I'm not saying you have to be a billionaire, here's an article from a recent dropout who landed a decent job I wouldn't mind.
- Another post full of inspiration.
LIFE GOES ON:
- I'm still here. Blogging this right now. I didn't die. I told all my friends and family. I didn't die of embarrassment. I didn't disappoint them to death. My law school administrators were GREAT. They worked with me and helped me talk it out, and come to the best decision for me.
- Yes, I'm going to have to get a move on, and find a job, move forward with other plans, but it's not terrible. People sympathise with my situation, and are very willing to help.
- People hate lawyers anyway, you can at least be glad to be done with lawyer jokes!
The comment from two different loved-ones that made the feeling that I've made the right choice really hit home?
"YOU SOUND RELIEVED."
I am.
If you find yourself in the aforementioned prison, just shut the books, take the key off the wall, and let yourself out. It might not be the easiest thing you ever did, but it won't be the worst. Certainly, I am still fresh to all of this. But hindsight right now is 20/20. Without the specter of all things law school looming around me, I can see clearly that I should have done this a long time ago.
If you're still not completely convinced, take a break. My law school was surprisingly chill about me taking a leave of absence. I did, and it gave me a great chance to really think this over. At the very least, talk to people! Talk to your family, friends, school administrators, counselors, financial aid office, professors, gurus, pastors, rabbis, priests, God, therapist... whoever! (Me?) If you keep it all locked up, you'll only get more miserable.
Yes, some people are capable of hating their jobs, but still being successful. But you don't have to be one of those people. If you've just had a bad few weeks of school, give it some time and things may very well turn around. But if you find yourself in prison, and you find yourself reading an article like this... give it a rest already. Take a break or quit, but don't torture yourself any longer!
Next time on How to Quit Law School: The legal-style memo I wrote myself to analyze quitting law school.
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